AV Geeks Lunch 11-26-2025

Hello everybody. I'm Skip Alzheimer. Welcome to the AV Geeks Lunchtime streaming show where we watch old 16 mm films. And I am pre-recording this show because I am going to be driving a van and moving film scanners and shelves. Uh trying to set up equipment at the archive space. Um, so that hopefully on um, uh, Friday I'll be able to do a show live from there and actually scan stuff while we're um, and stream it live like we used to do. That's the plan. Anyways, so today I have some things that uh I have been working with uh someone with some NARA National Archives material and so um there's some great things in here. First thing is a steps saving kitchen. This is made to talk about what is an ideal kitchen uh for the modern housewife circa. I don't know 1940s30s I think 40s maybe 50s. Uh next is the rural uh electrification agency story which talks about the push to bring power to rural parts of the United States uh to kind of get people so that uh I don't know you have electricity then that increases the ability for people to have lights which means that they have a longer workday and you know etc etc. There's good and bad to that I think. Uh then um but we're all benefiting we all benefited from that. Uh then finally interpreting the bicesentennial where they talked to national parks employees about the importance of the bsentennial and how they were all uh looking forward to celebrating it um at their different parks. So this is all government stuff. Um, anyways, uh, tomorrow, uh, Thursday is also going to be pre-recorded and I have a special theme show for that. So, it's going to be clips of different things that you'll just have to watch tomorrow and see. Uh, but then I hope to be back, like I said, on Friday and uh, we'll do a show. So, thanks for tuning in today and if you like what you saw, hit the thumbs up, hit the like button. Uh, if you want to donate, why don't uh, why don't you find someone local you can donate to? uh as far as uh food related stuff, food pantry, um food bank types of things cuz some people are struggling and nobody needs to go hungry in this country. Um anyways, uh thanks for watching and we will see you soon. Take care. Bye. Heat. Heat. These plans were developed for people just like you. People who are interested in having the very latest ideas in design that will help them cut down on the time and the effort that must be spent in doing kitchen work. Since you folks have an old-fashioned kitchen, you know the amount of stooping and reaching that must be done and the running from one corner of the kitchen to the other. During the last few years, our bureau and the land grant colleges have received hundreds of requests from farm homemakers asking for suggestions that would help them do their kitchen work faster and more easily. That's why we've developed this kitchen. Well, uh, just how did you go about developing the design for this U kitchen? >> We based our planning on established principles of work simplification to supply storage space and workspace for all the activities that take place there arranged for maximum convenience and with good working heights and good light. Incidentally, we developed this U arranged kitchen first, but the principles of planning we used we can apply to other arrangements such as the L and the corridor type. Laboratory research in our bureau and in the state agricultural experiment stations has made evident many of the requirements of a good kitchen. For example, we have learned that more counter space is required for the making of cookies and bread than for any other mixing operation. Experiments have shown that we need at least 36 in and that 42 in is a more desirable length for the mixing counter. Different kitchen jobs have been studied to determine the most comfortable working height for each. To obtain different heights in our kitchen, we use pullout boards. We designed revolving corner cupboards to make the greatest use of available space. These bring things out in the open so they're easily seen and reached. Models for many features were made and experimented with. Some were used, some discarded. Good lighting is important in the kitchen. To obtain this, we developed a design for a homemade fixture which would enable the farmer to use modern lighting at minimum cost. A shallow wooden trough in which we mounted four 40W fluorescent tubes was hung 8 in from the ceiling above the work centers. And finally, our kitchen began to take form. The units for each activity were put together to secure an orderly sequence of work. We planned this kitchen to take care of the preparation of food, eating, clearing, and some food preservation as a convenient place for the telephone and for making out menus and market orders. We also included a planning center. The planning desk is actually a drop leaf table on casters which can become a teacart or an extra work or dining table. By placing a large picture window across the end of the kitchen, we gained the benefit of natural light over all work surfaces. Since most women prefer to work from right to left, we place the mixing center in the right leg of the U between the refrigerator and the sink center. In the mixing center, as in all other work areas, we planned storage facilities to take care of all of the supplies and the equipment used in that center. These revolving corner shelves make it possible to store the heavy and frequently used foods near working level. They are roomy enough to hold all of the staple supplies used here. Just below counter level, shallow drawers give handy access to small equipment used in the mixing center. Even in the best of kitchens, one will have to stoop sometimes. Store here only things used occasionally like picnic supplies, extra-l large baking utensils, and odds and ends. See how easy it is to get at what you want. We designed the smaller top shelf for long-handled pans to allow full use of the shelf space below. Space ordinarily wasted is utilized to advantage by these built-in bins for flour and sugar. Another advantage is that they eliminate canisters which take up counter surface. Behind the door, a container holding 40 lb of flour feeds into the smaller bin below. Top shelf space is used to good advantage by vertical files for baking pans. This does away with stacking and with stooping or excessive reaching. This mixing center, like the other centers in our kitchen, embodies all the principles of good planning. Thus, it has plenty of work surface at comfortable heights, well lighted by natural and artificial lighting with everything needed stored within easy reach. For sitting at work, this pull out board at lap level, 26 in above the floor, gives a good working height. It permits a woman to sit comfortably in an ordinary kitchen chair with a good back rest, her feet flat on the floor while she's working at long and tedious jobs. To supply additional work surface in food preservation, the table from the planning center can be easily rolled over and placed next to the pullout board. To the left of the mixing counter is the vegetable preparation and dishwashing center. With knife rack and utensil cupboard at the right, vegetables in front of her, and sink at the left, this worker has a step-saving setup for preparing vegetables. A garbage hatch in the counter eliminates stooping and avoids repeated handling of garbage. The pale in the metal line compartment below can be removed for emptying from the outside through an insulated door in the wall. All bins and the compartments into which they fit are designed for easy cleaning. In the cooking and serving center are all of the supplies and equipment used at the range. Right above the range are bins built into the wall for foods such as cereals that go directly into boiling water and also for seasonings that are used at the range. Notice how these doors fold back safely out of the way. Serving dishes and range utensils are close at hand. The serving counter next to the range is convenient to the dish cupboards. Sliding doors back of this counter and cupboard give access from the dining room side. In the dishwashing center, dishes are scraped directly into the garbage hatch and stacked ready for washing. A double bowl sink provides for both washing and draining. The one on the right is shallow, about 5 in deep, making for a comfortable height for dishwashing. The drainer hangs across the deeper bowl with room at the side for emptying liquids. This bowl, because of its depth, 8 in, is also satisfactory for washing large quantities of fruits and vegetables. Just back of the faucets is a cupboard for storing soaps and cleaning supplies. Extra supplies and a handy waste paper basket are kept under the sink. After they're scalded and dried, silver, glass, and dishes are stored in adjoining cupboards. Here's a handy rack for drying dish towels. Out of the way of meal preparation is this storage closet. Besides cleaning equipment, it has a rack for first aid supplies, convenient for emergencies. The upper section is reserved for a few jars of canned foods, saving trips to the food storage room. This serving counter adjacent to the range is convenient to both the dining room and the kitchen dining table. This attractive dining space has been planned to be compact but not cramped. It gives ample room for a table that can be extended to seat six comfortably. A ledge under the large picture window is wide enough to hold the electrical equipment used at the table. Shelves below give convenient storage space. In this kitchen that has made her task of food preparation so much lighter. The housewife can share her family's enjoyment at meal time. the electrification of rural America. Not so long ago, this magic force, electricity, was available to city people and city people alone. Yes, as recently as 1935, nine out of 10 farmers were without electricity. Many of them, along with lots of other rural people, had given up hope of getting it in their lifetime, but they did get it. And about 97 out of every 100 farms have it now. How did this happen? Well, more than half of them got it from electric systems which they built with money borrowed from the Rural Electrification Administration, REA. There's quite a story behind those early days when REA was first put on the job by the president and the Congress. A human personal story that happened in many places all over the country. Let's meet some of the people who are familiar with this great American story. Miss Sarah Lee Puit, poultry woman. Dan Walker, dairyman. Ernie Thomas, manager of an electric cooperative. Ed Barnes, co-op lineman. Al Hansen, rural mailman. Yes, they all share in the REA story. This meter is measuring kilowatt hours. That might mean more if you know exactly what a kilowatt hour can do. It can run a TV set for 3 hours, a washing machine for nearly 4 hours, and a clock for 20 days. What the average farm worker can do in a working day, an electric motor can do in a matter of minutes. Life in rural America has not only been changed by cheap electricity, it's been revolutionized. Let's see how electricity has changed life for a farm family in the south. Miss Sarah Lee Puit and her brother Gary are in business together raising laying hens. But Sarah Lee remembers those days before rural electrification came along. Those drab colorless days. >> I sure do remember. I was much younger then. Of course, just a mere child. Some of the kids around us had to quit school too early, including my brother and me. We were needed here on the farm. What good was education when there didn't seem to be any hope for a better life? And I remember dad trying to raise corn and cotton to make a living for us. >> Mother's chores began at sunup. She had a lot of miles to feed. And what did we eat in winter? grits, salt, pork, and whatever we had been able to can ourselves. In summer, there was hardly any meat at all, wouldn't keep without a refrigerator. When the weather turned cold, the only way we had to keep warm was by the wood range. But when the temperature climbed to 102, is it surprising we called those things sad irons? In fact, life in general was pretty sad. And then one day, wonder of wonders, it happened. Magic. Magic from nowhere and everywhere. The magic of electricity. Light whenever we needed it, day or night. Our neighbor George Andre could hardly wait till he had his lights. And even dad himself couldn't quite believe the miracle. And then he let mother have the thrill of turning on the lights herself. All that power right at the touch of our fingertips. And music. Music all the way from Atlantic City. When mother first got her new electric iron, she was a little suspicious of it. But it didn't take long before she couldn't do without it. My cousin Louise Puit didn't quite trust her electric range either. Not until her cornbread took the blue ribbon at the county fair. For the first few days, Miss Phelps left the light burning day and night just to convince herself that electricity had really come. Joe Kelly, dear soul, kept all the sockets full, scared the electricity would leak out. But he caught on. And little by little, we all did. caught on to the many different things electricity could do. Running water right in our own home. Even Niagara Falls never looked so pretty. Wasn't long after that when lots of us kids could go back to school. Good light made studying easier. And having water indoors meant that we didn't have to run outdoors on bad days. So, we had fewer coals, our attendance records got better, and so did our grades. For a change, we were really proud to bring our report cards home to the folks. When our church got its lights, people seemed to come more often. And you know what? The singing was better, too. Guess folks could finally make out the words. It was electricity that put my brother Gary and me into the poultry business. Today, thanks to new electrical inventions, we are able to water and feed larger and larger flocks. Electricity weighs out the feed, blends it, and literally serves it to the chickens. In the short days of winter, an electric light fools the hins into thinking it's still daytime. So, they keep right on laying. But that isn't all. Just look at some of the other things that electricity does for us. Electricity keeps hins comfortable, and a contented hinn cooperates. Electricity cleans candles, grades, and it keeps eggs cool. Yes. Between Gary and me, we look after 8,000 hens. Just the two of us, and they lay almost 500 dozen eggs a day. That means deliveries almost every day and money in the bank. But surely Gary and I aren't the only ones who have profited in Rainbow County. Take Charlie Holmes. Holds a responsible position in town and on his farm turns out 10,000 brawlers at a clip four times a year. Yes, wherever I go, I see a lot of changes in Rainbow County. Our electric cooperative has the biggest payroll in these parts. And even though folks here in town don't get their electricity from the co-op, it's still done a lot for them. It's created an entirely new farmer market for any number of things. Things the farmer has come to use only since his farm became electrified. Food freezers, hot and cold running water, electric heating throughout the house, and an electric blanket in every bedroom. As for myself, I'm happy for what I see around me. A comfortable home with all electric conveniences. Time of my own to take things a little easy. And a young niece who actually thinks an electric dishwasher is fun. Washing dishes certainly wasn't fun when I was that age. Now, let's go to Adams County in the Midwest for another part of our story. I'm Dan Walker, member of the Adams Electric Cooperative. This is my part of the story, and this is my dairy farm in the Midwest. It's modern. It's efficient. It's electric. Electricity also does the cleaning for us better and faster than we could do it ourselves. Couple of hours and the whole job's done for the morning. Now I'm going to take care of one of the easiest chores of them all. Today is the day to read the meter. Ever hear of a customer figuring his own bill? Well, that's the point. We don't consider ourselves customers. No, we're all member owners of our cooperative. Uncle Sam loaned us the money to build it, but we're paying him back with interest. So you see, I don't think of this thing as a bill. It's a paycheck. A paycheck for the best worker I could hire. Electricity. Yes. The way we look at it, electricity works for us like a hired hand. No. Not until electricity came along, or should I say REA, did we know what we were missing around these parts. And I'm Al Hansen, male man on this route for nearly 41 years. In that time, I've seen more changes around here than I can count. What's brought them about? For my money, it's been these paved roads and the coming of electricity. Well, look who's home for Thanksgiving. Bert Shannon, a senior at agricultural engineering school. When he graduates, he'll be back to help run the Shannon farm. Nowadays, lots of kids are staying on the farm. Wasn't that way before electricity. Here on the Ferguson farm, an air conditioner being delivered. Joe's trucks are plenty busy these days delivering one electric thing after another. Doc Williams. He set up business out here because he could get electric and telephone service. He's a real country doctor. And we're sure glad we got him. Before Paul Jigan built this dress factory, he made sure that he could get all the power he needed. If you ask me, they turn out some mighty nicel looking styles here. I know my daughter sure likes to wear them. Let me tell you, we're mighty grateful for all the jobs his factories given us. Seems like everywhere I look in Adam Scott County, I see another new home. That population explosion they keep talking about is sure in evidence around here. They say in the past 10 years demand for power doubled and I understand before long it's going to double again. Our co-op has sure got a job cut out for it. Let's go farther west for another chapter in the REA story. Ernie Thomas is my name. I manage an electric cooperative here in Montana. Surprised I'm doing my job at the controls of a plane. Well, it's all in a day's work. Today, for instance, I've got to fly over 500 miles to discuss business with a member of our co-op. In this country, flying is the easiest way to visit our members. The territory we serve is that spread out. On the way, I patrol our lines on the lookout for anything that might cause us trouble later on. We call this preventive maintenance. Yes, there are nearly 3,000 m of power lines down there. Our co-op furnishes power to even the most isolated rancher and at reasonable rates. This is what REA calls area coverage and nearly all co-ops in every part of the country have achieved it. That's the Peterson wheat farm up ahead. Bill and his family use close to 800 kwatt hours a month every month. As town residents, the Petersons wouldn't use nearly half that much. You see, in operating their farm, they use a lot of electricity. When one of Bill's machines breaks down, he can't afford to wait around for parts or a repairman. So, he and Bill Jr. are do-it-yourself men. They have to be self-reliant, and they're mighty proud of their complete service shop. Right on their farm, several miles to the north in cattle country lives their good neighbor, Ted Forester. Ted's a prosperous cattleman and he's pretty independent, too. Independent of everything, that is, except electricity. Electric motors pump water for his cattle, while electric heaters keep it from freezing. Labor and time-saving devices like these, every one of them run by electricity, sure take the drudgery out of cattle feeding on Ted Forers's farm. And that electric infrared heat is good for raising healthy pigs, too. We're farther along now, approaching sheep country. Most of them, by the way, were bruted by infrared lamps, and they're sheared by electricity as well. Down there is the Indian reservation. They're putting up a new school. Yes, cooperative power is making it possible to expand these important educational facilities out here. You know, come summer and this will be dry country. So, water conservation is a must. That reservoir stores water till spring and then many of our members use irrigation systems electrically powered. to help grow their crops. Now, there's an oil refinery, a good example of how our co-op serves industry, different industries. I'm especially proud of the part our co-op plays in the national defense system. We are one of several who supply electrical energy to these strategic remote warning outposts. And now for the business at hand. My appointment on the ranch of one of our members, Hal Murray. As I pointed out earlier, Hal's Ranch is located in one of the outlying counties over 500 miles away from the cooperative office. And I don't believe that any member uses more power than Hal does. In fact, he and his family consume about as much electricity as four average city families. Now Hal wants even more so that he can hook up some new electrical equipment he's just bought. and he'll get it. Yes, our way of life has certainly become dependent upon electricity. So, you can readily understand how helpless we can be. And here's the latest bulletin on the storm closing in on our area. Heavy snows continue to move across the border accompanied by gales up to 70 m an hour. The storm is expected to inflict more statewide damage than the severe blizzard of 7 years ago. A power failure has been reported directly north of the city. Stand by for the next bullet. A power failure or outage as we call it rarely happens because our lines are engineered to withstand the rugged weather in this part of the country. But when we do have an outage, we're out of business. 51. >> The two-way radios dispatch our crews to a troubled area in no time flat. >> Why are you fellas coming out there? over here and take care of that fire over. >> I see. Uh, you figure you'll be through by 2:00 anyway. >> Uh, we'll get him over. >> Okay, fine, Ed. You give us a call if you need anything. Our crews go to work in a hurry. In fact, even before the news breaks over the air, we're on the job. It's a tough job and a dangerous one, but our men are well trained and know how to handle it. Then, just as suddenly, we're back in business again. Well, that's pretty much what it's like these days in Montana. If you get the idea that we think REA and area coverage are the most important things that ever hit our state, you're right. You haven't seen the whole story of rural electrification. And the reason is simple. The end isn't in sight. Countless chapters such as these remain to be written. And they will be. They will be because electrified rural America has a future ahead of it. A big, bright, beautiful future. Yeah. Heat. Heat. parks are going to have to be something else than what they are now. They're going to have to be something else than the the the playgrounds of uh uh the uh uh leisure class. you know, years ago, park service, uh, our management of the parks was a kind of a loose thing and and it's a it's a good thing. Everybody accepted it, but more and more as time goes by, we we're more accountable to the American people for what we do. And we better damn well uh do things well uh not do them at all. What the people in the park service should not do first is is to think that what they have in their mind uh is is going to be Bible or is going to be the way that things are going to be done. Uh what I would suggest would be that they would involve people at the local level everywhere where there is a national park site. involve people at the local level to give input to what they're going to do so that the people of the area surrounding that park where there's going to be a site uh will feel a part of the bicesentennial because that's what the bsentennial is all about people The girls dance is one of the demonstrations that will correspond to the exhibits in the Martineis adobe. And these are exhibits of culture that existed at the time John Mureer and his family were in this area. We will be offering a program called 200 years and goal to go. >> We're putting up a ice skating rink. We have the musket firing demonstration that goes on every week. >> We want to have a big Fourth of July picnic at the port which will be a first of its kind. >> Got to hold the wheels and kind of push. Here we go. >> Okay. Swing it. Swing it out that way now. Right through here. Going to go left here now. >> Not too fast. Not too fast. We have a Civil War cannon here and we put people through an actual Civil War cannon drill so they can see how it was for the old Civil War soldier >> company. That's it. That's it. That's it. That charge down there. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. That's it. Ram it home. That's it. Break that charge. Hit it. ONE, TWO, THREE. READY? OH. One new program that we just started this past summer and we'll be developing more into a bsentennial theme is using a mountain man of the 1830 period. He's all dressed in buckkins with a fur hat and he's carrying a a hawking rifle and beaver traps. We hope to uh reenact the Spanish exploration of the hillside which we're standing on 1776. This evening we're going to take a small tour of Fort Yellowstone which we have built over the last several years. The army does a very fine job of building its forts as you can well see. Just here in front of us over where that old cow elk is standing is our ski hill. And many of the soldiers from the east when they come out here to Yellowstone do not know how to cross country ski. and all we do is take >> I think the part of the Fort Yellowstone for example allows the visitor and the American people to to see the role that the army played in the preservation of our parks and I think this is an important part of our bsentennial we just about lost Yellowstone at one time due to poaching and the various administrations that were a little corrupt drank that strong black coffee and chomp away on those old hard attack and maybe crack a tooth or so on. They're going to find out how it was for that Civil War soldier. >> The visitor will have an opportunity to see an 18th century play. >> Does the courage of anyone among us under fresher arms begin to fail? Recall to remembrance the wonders God hath wrought for our fathers and in our time. How have we seen Lewisburg, that thorn IN OUR SIDES, BROUGHT TO THE DUST TO THE ASTONISHMENT OF THE WORLD by New England troops? Uh we'll also be offering uh a program in literature. >> We want to do some American jazz concerts. Old Turk Murphy. >> I'd like to see at the information centers the park service handing out copies of the Declaration of Independence during the bsentennial with a little leaflet of what our founding principles are. >> The fur trapper uh can stand as a a very romantic figure that the park visitor can identify with. >> Welcome to the Liberty Bell. This is the authentic Liberty Bell. However, it was not always known as that. It was ordered from England in 1751 to be the state house bell for the state of Pennsylvania. It was ordered to commemorate the 50th anniversary of William Penn's Charter of Privileges, which granted religious freedom to the colonists of Pennsylvania. To each one of these groups, the bell is going to mean their own freedoms, what they're they are personally fighting for. gone. >> I don't I can't see it. >> Some of our most effective uh situations are one to one or one to a small group. And our people like to have an oldfashioned campfire program with no no props, just a fire which may or may not burn, sitting around and and having a rap session. Starting out with the central theme, but then going into what people are asking about. Traveling exhibits and uh plastic streamers and uh paperiermâché musketss and so on are just so much garbage in my opinion. I think parks are going to become ever more a luxury in a society that's striving more and more toward simple survival. And if parks are a luxury, then during this period, expenditures in parks that simply put frosting on those luxuries are going to be viewed as scance. I think the most important thing as we approach this bicesentennial is our need to to carry these projects through with integrity. We have to be honest about what has happened and we have to be honest about the way we're working together. So that the the story comes across that way. You can't just make things that aren't really um although they may they may be good, they may be interesting and entertaining, if they aren't real, it's not going to work. And and there just can't be anything phony in it. It is important and it's not a show. It's a real serious look at where we are and how we got here. It seems that most of the bicesentennial activity has been aimed toward revolutionary period and revolutionary areas. And of course, those of us who are not 200 years old or do not have uh these ties are having a rather difficult time in finding exactly where we fit into the whole scheme of things. people need an understanding perhaps that uh that it's not just uh reenactments of what happened in Philadelphia and Boston and on the east coast that it can be more than that. I think people are kind of hung up on the idea that it's a an eastern thing. Our approach I think to the bicesentennial should be as much as possible within the scope of the experience of the community. If the community ancestors didn't date back to the American Revolution, they simply do not necessarily relate to the figures of the American Revolution. It would be nice if if we could somehow get get those peoples to to work with us and develop programs that really meant something to them. As far as I I can personally see, those ought to be programs that explained and clarified their own cultural cultures and their their contributions to to what we are here in the States today. >> The community brings much to the park. We'd be, I'm afraid, much more sterile if we didn't have the community participation that we do have. And we enjoy participating with the community and their things as well. It makes a richer experience for both of us. I think >> this outfit probably has as good a spiritual base and value system base as any outfit in government. And I think if if uh uh we're not just functionaries, we're dealing with with with with the heritage. And if if this group can't find somewhere within this bicesentennial blob a place to grab onto and say, "Hey, we're important again." Then it's pretty hopeless. >> We have gone far, but not always in the right direction. to look back over our history uh and not only look back but feel back into our history and decide what things we have done which are of permanent value and where we have gone wrong. Now, uh if you can do that, it's a vastly more importance than to uh parade and celebrate, isn't it? I I think one of the things we could uh even dedicate ourselves to in the bsentennial would be to evaluate each one of our historical presentations particularly the historical presentations and that includes uh prehistory too uh and say uh uh are we giving uh those other parties who were part of the American story a fair shake? uh are are are they part of us now or are they still them? >> There's been times when I've been to Indian schools and in the pueblo and I find that people still or teachers rather still uh ask the question who discovered America and and the Indian children have to say Columbus to them that's a lie. Uh whenever I go to a community in northern New Mexico and and I ask the question, who are your forefathers? And and they have to say the pilgrims. I think that's wrong. I think that they need to recognize that their forefathers were also an individual part and a very important part of the formation of this country and they didn't necessarily land at Plymouth Rock. Well, I've gone through so many books, but they all are really uh overcoled and uh the fact that I don't think I would even let some uh any of my grandchildren read it. The fact that it's not the true story really. Well, sure, history is always written by the victor and uh the victor likes a nice bright shining night story. you know, the the terrible Indian savage and the poor, long-suffering Anglo immigrant. But if you see it from the other side, that ain't the way it works. Historical accounts do not say what actually happened. It's somebody's viewpoint. And I think we're going to realize that you can't get the whole truth about the past. The best you can do is get a lot of different viewpoints about it. But I think that uh park service can certainly become more orientated if they can have that respect uh of say the Indian people as well as the Spanish people uh in telling the story about our people as well as other people with regards to history and what it is today. I think we must be honest and truthful about what we say. honest history is is not often easy to swallow and but maybe the country is maturing enough, the people are maturing enough that we could be a little more honest with with our history. Maybe what has to happen uh as a starter is is uh uh within each area uh somebody who who has some deep thoughts about which way to go, how to use their particular resource to to touch on these deep questions. Uh maybe that somebody should just start trying to do it. Okay. And that that brings up a question. How do uh how do park managers who may have a very traditional attitude? How are they how are they going to uh uh receive uh people who are essaying uh uh new approaches? And many of these are going to be controversial. Uh uh it's going to be it it isn't going to be easy. There aren't going to be any uh little packages with pretty ribbons on them and all you do is open the package and Jack in a Box comes out and and does it. It's going to be individual people doing it like it always has been. >> I guess if I could say anything that would mean something to maybe somebody else and it would really come from the bottom of my heart, it would be to people like myself, I would ask them to not fear the people from above and their conservative point of view sometimes because that has a tendency to uh intimidate uh young ideas and new ideas and things. You know, this country was built on a a basis of new ideas, things that at the time they didn't think would work, but some people just kept persevering and they did work. I think that we really need that now, especially now because we're nearing the turn of the century. Uh we'll be in the year 2000 pretty soon. And where will we have been uh if we don't come up with some really progressive things? Well, I would like to encourage, you know, and and give our people the certainly the the backing that they have, the opportunity in the National Park Service, as I think they have had for a long time to be innovative uh and certainly during this bicesentennial period to uh to be experiment uh experimentalist to uh to try out new new ways of of uh interpretation to uh try out new techniques. Uh some of them I'm sure we're going to find quickly or maybe not the answer, but uh I'm certain that a lot of good ideas are going to come out of this. >> You talked about uh the American people reflecting on what's happened in this country. Perhaps it's a time for employees to reflect on on what's happened to the National Park Service. And uh we look on ourselves as protectors of the park, but I think we need also to remember that uh we serve the American people. The American people own the parks. Parks do belong to the people. And so that's part of the role. And we've got to keep that in mind at all times. And how how to uh how to get people really to say to themselves, hey, this is different. This really is important. This isn't just some more of that hordatory stuff. That's the problem. It's motivation. >> This is a crisis. Uh uh the greatest crisis maybe that the country has ever had. Uh democracy is under test. Uh we're we're now to find out whether it's workable with the people of 200 odd million people as it was when we had a straggling of people along the Atlantic coast. Will it work? Uh will it work with with uh such a vast number of people? We don't know cuz it's never happened before in the world. A lot of people are are going to be uh uh saying that, you know, my problem today is that I've got uh uh children to feed. I've got unemployment facing me. I've got many of the other serious problems of inflation and and so forth that we're uh certainly is on the doorstep of most uh homes of most Americans today. But I think that we uh can utilize uh this great period in time which has been so well uh preserved in in the historical facilities and historical annals of of the National Park Service as a an opportunity to renew uh a new dedicated uh spirit uh to maybe challenge our our value structure, our pri priority. priorities and I think also to entertain a a new uh uh standard of of hope for this country and for the people of this world.